Mosque gets Ok...

[collegetrumpet2010]

So, please stop with this they are only a small percentage of the population so we shouldn't worry.

Seriously. I consider myself Christian. Always have. Whack jobs from any faith, no matter the percentage of that religion among our population, are a threat.

[CoeburnCane]

As I've said, I have no problem with what religion you choose. However, when the religion you choose directly wants to affect the rest of society I have a problem.

If I read that and didn't know you were talking about Islam, I could have easily assumed you were talking about Christianity in America today. That's my point--no disagreement from me on your POV re: Islam and its' extremists.

What's next Westboro Baptist Church building a community center in a homosexual section of San Francisco?

Wouldn't put it past them--and by you saying that, I think you at the core agree with me that the extremists in Christian America today are just as worthy of us being suspicious of as the Islamic groups are. Just an assumption on my part, but that's what it sounds like.

They're a threat to how our nation should be run just as much as this Mosque/community center is. I simply find it hard to believe that we tolerate Christianity trying to control our government and are super-suspicious of anything Islamic, especially given the First Amendment (for all the Tea Partiers out there) which clearly defines both separation of church and state AND freedom of ANY religion in America.

Any government action to stop the Mosque from being built violates the First Amendment, IMO, and any government sanctioned Christian movement to be intolerant of another religion would violate it as well. We're walking a fine line as far as government/religion still being separated goes, and when that line gets completely blurred and eventually erased, is when we should ALL worry.

[pvfan]

What you and R13 fail to realize is that I am against Christianity controlling our government as much as I am against Islam or any other religion controlling our government. The biggest problem in our country in regards to religion is the fact that Christians do not want anyone else to worship or get political gain and those who aren't Christians want anybody other than Christians to worship and get political gain. It's pretty pathetic.

[CoeburnCane]

What you and R13 fail to realize is that I am against Christianity controlling our government as much as I am against Islam or any other religion controlling our government.

No--no, I realize that. I said as much above in my assumptions. Don't mix me up w/R13 on this one. Me and you have had this discussion before in another thread in the past--that's one thing where we see relatively eye-to-eye.

The biggest problem in our country in regards to religion is the fact that Christians do not want anyone else to worship or get political gain and those who aren't Christians want anybody other than Christians to worship and get political gain. It's pretty pathetic.

I don't mind if someone is a Christian and wants to hold political office. The moment I mind is when they try to interject their religious beliefs into the office they hold.

I want our leaders to make the right decisions based on the facts in front of them in the world today, not based on a religiously driven agenda that strives to make our government a theocracy, and that goes for outdated OT law or Sharia law either one.

I want Christians to worship their God, and their religion. I want Muslims to do the same, Bhuddists, Scientologists, Mormons, JW's, etc...all of those religions fall under the First Amendment and freedom of religion. I simply wish that Christians and other religions wouldn't vilify religions other than theirs and spread hatred and unrest because some other groups of people believe differently. That's a lofty ideal, I know, but THAT really more than anything is what makes me sick when it comes to any religion. I say let them all live and worship happily. Why is that so hard for these people who believe in a religion to understand and put into action? It seems that our existence today is one big ball of hatred perpetrated by one religion against another, and we've all forgotten how to get along w/our fellow man and make this life as happy as we can make it for all of us.

[pvfan]

I agree you with pretty much on everything you said. I still think the main problem is that I worry more about the Islamic nuts and you worry more about the Christian nuts. They are both bad, and I'll even admit that the reason I don't worry about the Christian nuts is because I'm white and grew up in the Bible Belt. The Islamic crazies may hurt me, the Christian crazies wont.

[CoeburnCane]

The Islamic crazies may hurt me, the Christian crazies wont.

Maybe, but that's where our opinions diverge.

Given our "Bible Belt" area, how many Christian crazies are we, me and you in this area, going to come across?

Now, how many Islamic crazies are we going to come across in this same area?

The answers to those 2 questions are why I'm always more concerned w/someone who bastardizes Christianity for their own ends than I am Muslims who do the same w/Islam.

Until the Islamic extremists decide to bomb Wise County and threaten me directly, I'll let the larger populations of the US concentrate on how they want to respond to them, and I'll be more focused on how Christian crazies can readily affect my everyday way of life through our local and state governments. The larger targets are what the Islamic crazies are after, and I'm not there. Call it self-preservation if you wish, but that's my rationale.

Now--does that mean I don't have concerns regarding Islamic extremist terrorism? Absolutely not. I'm just more worried about the clear and present danger of my immediate surroundings given the density of Christians and the likelihood percentage-wise of extremism in this area that could harm/affect me.

[pvfan]

I see your point, and agree. Religion plays way to much of a role in our local governments, especially in the local school systems.

[Milk3]

Why is Obama so worried about the Constitution when it comes to building this mosque but when it came to the health care bill he didn't care for it so much?

[R13]

The bill isn't unconstitutional, nice try.

As for the muslims and small percentage of the population, in your lifetime Muslims will be the majority of the population of Europe. Those who have the majority rule, and even you can't dispute that. So, please stop with this they are only a small percentage of the population so we shouldn't worry. If they want to practice and be tolerate fine. If not, they fit my book like the radical Christians, Jews, Atheists, and every other religous fruit cake does.

Sorry, there is around 800 million people in Europe and 50 million of them are Muslims, they aren't going to be a majority in my lifetime if ever. Even if we assume that's somehow right, majority numbers don't equal majority power, they will always be a minority group(which doesn't have to do with numbers) in Europe IMO. Definitely not anytime soon. When it's 0.6% of the population, it's notihng to worry about, assuming I'm actually worried about it at all - which I'm not, no more than any other group. A nut is a nut, religion doesn't have all that much to do with it, they will use whatever tool they can - sometimes it's Islam, sometimes Christianity or whatever else they can.

[pvfan]

There is no use in talking to you about this. You refuse to accept facts, you get on here all the time and chime about people not providing you facts, but when they do you don't accept them. Go do some research, it'll be 2:1 white Europeans to Muslims in Europe over the next 25 years. Unless you plan on dying at an early age you'll see it.